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John McCarthy asks travel writer Michael Jacobs about the journey he made down the Andes from Venezuela to Patagonia. Michael reveals how a bus trip can turn into a test of nerves and what happened when he went to visit the last speaker of a native language in Patagonia.

John also talks to Roz Strickland who worked as a volunteer in an orphanage in Rwanda and thinks that the country is unfairly characterised as simply about gorillas and genocide. She thinks there is a lot more to it than that - not least the friendliness of the people once viciously divided. It could be the basis of attracting the visitors Rwanda crucially needs.