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Do we get a chance to vote on what we actually thought of the trial last night?

Given all the hype about how the programme was going to really get under the skin of the crisis, it seems that in the end it lacked bite. Am I the only one whose bubble was burst?

Where is Paxman? What have you done to quieten Paul M today, and how come Pesto is in such a good mood this morning?

There are some fundamental questions cropping up time and time again both on Robert and Paul's blogs (i.e. where is the money coming from, and is it wise to prop up a speculative housing bubble by 'forcing' the banks to re-instate crazy lending levels), yet this is being dodged by the media.

Come on Newsnight, show some cojones (Paul's words, not mine), and try to properly route out the causes and consequences of this crisis.

Why not investigate the role of the US neocons (ie William Kristol, Paul Wolfowitz and other people influenced by Leo Strauss) in the mess we're in now. Essentially, they created an ideology that drove (a) wars in Iraq and Afghanistan (and in general, the arrogant project for a 'new American century') (b) the attempt to privatize developing world economies via the IMF in the 80s and 90s and (c) ‘light touch’ regulation on capitalism which has led to the credit bubble and the current unprecedented banking crisis.

Thanks to the influence that has been achieved by these ideologues over the period since 1980, the western model of liberal democracy has been fatally compromised in the eyes of the rest of the world, and the US has effectively been reduced to one among four or five equally powerful states.

Perhaps your friend Irwin Stelzer can be brought in to answer the case.

the current page in the story is short stirling looks like its going to break its trend line from 24th sept which would be the first sign of easing in the bank lending.

as for the next page? Oil is back down to its its oct 2007 price. yet retail gas prices still go up? And firms make 70% profit from the public from gas storage. Given what we discovered about bank regulation in the trial yesterday is it not likely that ivory tower attitude and practices will be found among other govt regulators like the energy ones?

so the story is still the political guardian class did not guard us from exploitation by the financial oligarchy like they do not guard us from exploitation of the energy oligarchy?

i did read the nottingham mp was trying to bring a bill for a two way grid [or feed in tariff as they call it] but given the last time he tried it was smothered by the govt will he succeed this time?

i suppose news is just the many ways in which the guardian class does not guard us?

1. At 11:20am on 14 Oct 2008, Hawkeye_Pierce wrote:
Do we get a chance to vote on what we actually thought of the trial last night?

Given all the hype about how...
_____

Hmnn, yes. I wondered about that. Wasn't going to... er... 'vote' as I don't like how the results of such... er... 'votes' can get played up.

Then again, if it's not looking like things may go quite the way intended, maybe it's best not to have one at all. Or explain.

There are a few around who have form in this regard, as I recall.

PLEASE pick up on the next meltdown:



This is becoming an increasingly alarming issue to which, once again, our glorious political leaders seem oblivious. Until it's too late (again) perhaps?

Many thanks.

I tend to agree with the other posters on last nights trial. It was way too ambitious for such a small slot. If you had had a programme each for the "accused" and then a summing up programme that would probably also have been skating over the surface.

Thats why I think a public inquiry is the only way with all due respect to Newsnight.

But I suspect Labour feel that would disturb the mood of Gordon. In my world government policy and control will climb up the ranks as a factor.

Therefore I don't see why we won't hit this problem again and there will perhaps be a false confidence that we scraped through this crisis.

Nothing on the programme really brought home to me how we apparently had Alistair Darling waking up one morning saying "Cor blimey - economic meltdown!". Nobody in government seemed to see this coming which I find incredible and unlikely.

# 6 thegangofone

.... hence my suggestion in the post above yours. The political elite of our generation (and perhaps of previous generations?) have proven themselves to be rank incompetents when it comes to strategic thinking and planning, and preparing our nation for whatever lies ahead.

I find it such a joke listening to Gordon Brown forever banging on about his ability to deal with the 'long-term' as he wakes up one morning and says 'Oh Christ ... global financial meltdown ... where the hell did that come from?'.

So it will be with the end of cheap energy.

Hence the Labour Party's recent, panic-stricken conversion to nuclear energy. Who would have thought it eh?

#7 moraymint

I utterly agree on the incompetence in strategic planning and on energy.

I disagree though that Labours conversion was panic-stricken.

I tended to see the investment in green renewable production as woefully inadequate - but I always thought that was so they could then decide that they would go nuclear. They are very vulnerable to the big business lobby.

I am not a "union man" but I have always been surprised that they continued to fund them given that factor. It's like watching a very long divorce.

It will be interesting to see after this whether all of the city donors and other "fat cats" continue to see Labour as their "flexible friend" as Bernie Ecclestone might have said a few years back.

I was disappointed when watching last night's special program. It was clear that the panel judges were too lightweight to challenge the financial guru in the defendant's seat in any real way. This is the same problem with the current regulatory framework: Bankers that are in the market hot zone of financial innovations are always going to be light years ahead of a government bureaucratic charged with the job of regulating them. Government agencies like the Financial Services Authority will always find it hard (if not impossible) to attract the right people, since anyone who is qualified for the job and has the relevant experiences would have been lured by the city salary, which is easily 10 times more than what’s offered on a government payroll. Not to mention the vast majority of over-the-counter derivatives with non-existent oversight and reporting requirements, and the Special Purpose Corporations and Trusts in Cayman Islands set up to create, package and clear those derivatives transactions, which do not fall into the jurisdictions of UK regulatory and tax laws. If you want to start a fight with the big boys, you need to take out the big guns. I like McCains idea of having Warren Buffet as the chairman of Federal Reserve. It's about time the law-abiding taxpayers have people with brilliant minds on their side.

ave we learned nothing?

The markets are on the up, again. Prices are coming down, so we are looking for lower interest rates; and the way back to the next boom!

That philosophy was what got us into this mess. In any case, welcome as it has been, the latest (dead cat) bounce is the result only of (perhaps) resolving the banks’ liquidity crisis. We are still left with the increasing recession (depression?) in the global economy as a whole. Sooner or later, in a matter of days, stock prices will inevitably resume their downward trend. The danger is that, having again to reverted to the boom model, panic will take over the markets once more. We will be back again to our crisis.

We have got to take time out to plan where we really want to go.

I agree with previous comments about one programme being too short a time to explore the subject adequately but feel sure the blame game has not really reached its peak as yet. When I last looked at the results of the Vote on the Trial programme (after 1594 votes cast) the Government were quite rightly being voted as the factor most culpable. The Trial mentioned the following contributory factors to the financial crisis:
House price bubble.
Inadequate monitoring of the FSA.
Speculators/Bankers incentives bubble.
Public spending based on a growing debt bubble.
All these bubbles should have been pricked by Government as the body with overall responsibility for ensuring the financial world works to the benefit of UK PLC and not for its own means.
Government asleep on their watch is the verdict most of the Trial voters seem to be expressing.
How about a follow up Special programme when the dust settles a bit?

LOST IN TRANSLATION

Follow the history of the Neoconservatives in the USA. Look to where Trotsky and who funded him. Where did Soviet 'dissidents' go to? Then look into the history of Lehman Bros and who funded the 1917 revolution and why. Who is anti-statist? What is statism? Who in the first place? Why do we have less and less of a Welfare State as time goes by?

I see that share purchase options are being hammered by those lucky execs still in a job! They know their particular business is sound and buying in now whilst their own companies shares are cheap is a 'no brainer', so as to get through the coming slump obviously many of their workers will have to be sacrificed .... how satisfying!

GIVE THAT MAN A PRIZE - OH THEY DID.

A quote for our time, from the Booker winner.
"The poor can rise (in India) in two ways: through crime, or politics - A VARIANT OF CRIME."

Is there a 'Tony' prize for the best encapsualtion of politics?